URGENT: Ontairo Hummer Owners

[dbot]

<div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">This is what I found</font></div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">Commercial motor vehicle is defined in section 16-1 of the highway traffic act. From what I can see, a commercial vehicle operator registration is only needed if YOU ARE A COMMERCIAL CARRIER. If the vehicle is used for personal use, it is not considered a commercial motor vehicle (CMV). Here is the link to the Highway traffic act http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/DBLaws/Statutes/English/90h08_e.htm goto section 16 through 22 for cmv definition. As well this link: http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/trucks/cvor/regcert.htm  and http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/trucks/cvor/cvorq&a.htm has a little info on the MTO policy</font></div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">In addition, using th e-law and MTO website no matches for 3000 kg shows up in any ontario MTO document except for this http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/dandv/vehicle/register.htm , http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/dandv/vehicle/rgoutcan.htm , http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/news/regional/2002/070202b.htm as well as a couple more that just have a license fee table refereing to a cost for CMV that are under 3000 Kg.</font></div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">In summary,f</font><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">rom what I can see, the commercial vs non-commercial designation is determined by the use of the vehicle. If it is for personal use, with no fee being collected, then it is basically not a commercial vehicle.</font></div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">Perhaps the most definitive statement it the act is section 16-1- definitions as follows:</font></div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">---------------------</font></div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">Commercial motor vehicles</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">Definitions, ss. 16-23.1</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">16. (1) In this section and in sections 17 to 23.1,</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">"commercial motor vehicle" does not include,</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">(a) a commercial motor vehicle, other than a bus, having a gross weight or registered gross weight of not more than 4,500 kilograms, an ambulance, a fire apparatus, a hearse, a casket wagon, a mobile crane, a motor home or a vehicle commonly known as a tow truck,</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">(<img src='http://www.canadianhummerclub.com/forum ... >/cool.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='B)' /> a commercial motor vehicle leased for no longer than thirty days by an individual for the transportation of goods kept for that individual's personal use or the gratuitous carriage of passengers,</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">(c) a commercial motor vehicle operated under a permit and number plates issued under a regulation made under clause 7 (24) (g) or (h) that is not transporting passengers or goods,</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">(d) a commercial motor vehicle operated under the authority of an In-Transit permit, and</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">(e) a bus that is used for personal purposes without compensation; ("vhicule utilitaire")</font></div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">"compensation" includes any rate, remuneration, reimbursement or reward of any kind paid, payable or promised, or received or demanded, directly or indirectly; ("rmunration")</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">"CVOR certificate" means a Commercial Vehicle Operator's Registration Certificate issued under this Act; ("certificat d'immatriculation UVU")</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">"goods" includes all classes of materials, wares and merchandise and livestock; ("biens")</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">"operator" means the person directly or indirectly responsible for the operation of a commercial motor vehicle including the conduct of the driver of, and the carriage of goods or passengers, if any, in, the vehicle or combination of vehicles; ("utilisateur")</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">"safety record" means the safety record of an operator determined in accordance with the regulations; ("fiche de scurit") R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 16 (1); 1994, c. 27, s. 138 (<img src='http://www.canadianhummerclub.com/forum ... >/cool.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='8)' />; 1996, c. 33, s. 1; 2002, c. 18, Sched. P, s. 3 (1-3).</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">CVOR certificate required</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">(2) No person shall drive or operate a commercial motor vehicle on a highway unless the operator is the holder of a valid CVOR certificate. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 16 (2); 2002, c. 18, Sched. P, s. 3 (4).</font></div><div> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">-------------------------</font></div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">So, if you drive the vehicle as a limo service (bus) at any time, then you are required to have a CVM plate. In the case of duallies, for  any vehicle (ie pickup's) used to haul anything that is charged for is a CMV is needed if they are over 4500 Kg.  An Alpha has a GWVR of 10,300 lbs or 4681 Kg, still, if it is not used for commercial purposes then it is not a commercial vehicle.</font></div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">To support this, if you drive a CMV then you also need a CVOR, all identified refernces to CVOR, exclude non commercial vehicles.</font></div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">I have done a search every way I can think of but I may have missed something. the only way to be sure is to get the HTA section violation off of the ticket that the guy got. On the ticket will be a specific reference to the act and the section that was violated. It is then a simple matter to look at that section to see what it says.</font></div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div><div align="left" dir="ltr"><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">I have been told by someone that used to run a MTO office that with the heavier vehicles the license renewal sticker should be in the FRONT of the vehicle, that being because most heavier trucks are towing something and as a result the back plate can't normally be seen, again, this is not written anywhere in the HTA.</font></div><div> </div><div><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">If Phil can get the details on the ticket, I will look it up.</font></div><div> </div><div><font color="#0000ff" face="Arial" size="2">Asfar as the MTO goes, their call center is useless. They make up therules as they go in cases where it is obscure (there are a lot ofobscure sitautions in the HTA).... I know this from personal experiencewhen they screwed up my drivers license classifications a fewyears back.</font></div><div> </div><div>

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[alanized]

<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>My understanding is that the H1 Pick-up falls into the commercial category unless covered by a slant back roof. The tonneau cover does not provide an exemption. I have the annual inspection done anyway. It is not a bad extra safety check for $90.00.</FONT></DIV><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Alan Vigneux</FONT></DIV>

[R Cullen]

Re: Placement of the sticker.



  Here's the easy and fast rule. If your plate is commercial (black and white) it is required to be on the front. If it is personal plates (blue and white) it goes on the rear plate. The offence for not doing so is "Validation not properly displayed". That's $110 , no points.



  I've been stopped for no other reason than I'm driving a Hummer. Its pretty funny when I ask them why they are stopping me (routine check, yada yada), and show them that I'm a cop too. Truth is, not alot of cops drive Hummers, but most wish they did. I've been told I have improper tires (not), no mudflaps (not applicable),  and red lights on the front (they ain't red lights til I turn them on, and I would never do that on a highway, officer!). Best thing to do is be polite, give what you are required, and like this guy, take the ticket and research it. That way we can all learn.



And you are absolutely right, check the section he was charged under and see if it even applies. It would be an interesting one to test at court, because if it is tossed, it gives a precedent we can all use.

[dbot]

85-1 relates soley to safety inspection of vehicles that are specifically required to be be perioidically inspected (dump trucks, tractor trailers etc.). The fact that one has a valid license plate for a small truck is sufficient proof that the vehicle was inspected. If the truck is registered in the name of a company this can however can confuse the issue ossibly due to the weight f the hummer. <DIV> </DIV><DIV>If it was for a truck that was personally registered or the company use was for personal use only, the ticket has been issued in error from what I can see. I wouldn't pay it.</DIV><DIV> </DIV>