Canadian Hummer Club Forums

I have done a lot of research. I own a Mile Marker and 3 Warn winches. I have owned 1 other Mile Marker, a Champion, a SuperWinch and one other Warn.



The research that I have done is as follows. Any winch other than the MileMarker Hydraulic unit, that is mounted in a exposed location permanently, and has to go through our winter's will inevitably fail. Out of 3 Warn's I have taken apart to rebuilt, 2 had gearboxes filled with water as they were not sealed properly, or ran dry at some point.



Every MileMarker electric that I have seen that was exposed to the elements rusted significantly quicker than any Warn I have seen. These are absolute junk, and are cheaply made. Search for MileMarker electric on the HummerNetworkForums and you will see some of the results. Worst part is these fail quickly, while the Warn's degrade and slow down over time but it's fairly rare for them to just completely fail.

(See:



and http://www.hummernetworkforums.com/view ... ight=winch) This coming from probably one of the most active H1 owners around.





However, the MileMarker Hydraulic is a different story. You get what you pay for, and this unit is fantastic. Many people have been running them for years without issue and no corrosion issues.





In the end... Warn if you want a electric winch that will last long when constantly exposed to the elements (but not bullet proof). Mile Marker if you want a winch less likely to need a rebuild when used in severe weather, and when going hydraulic.





Just thought I would share before you spent your $$$

What are the main advantages of one over the other Tom? Does one offer weight or clearanceapproach angle savings over the other? Id imagine that one element that is nice about the Warn is that the vehicle need not be running for it to be used. How much would the avg customer be looking at for a Warn rebuild?

Seriously good question. I assume you are referring to electric vs. hydraulic.



To get a better understanding towards the differences between a electric winch and a hydraulic winch you need to know the basic principles behind it.

An electric winch is connected to your battery system, while a hydraulic winch is connected to your power steering pump in a series with your power steering box, and your hydro boost cylinder and relies on the pressure of your pump/system.



Basic Electric Winch Disadvantages

• Draws a significant load on your batteries, contrary to popular belief, your alternator does not provide enough of a charge to overcome the load your winch puts on your battery system. At idle an average truck alternator will produce a maximum of 90 amps (Our H1's have a peak of 124Amps @1800RPM), our factory Warn winches draw 109 Amps @ no load and 481(!!!)Amps at the full 12,000lb rating.
• Warn recommends (as does Mile Marker) to use our winches 1 minute ON for every 9 minutes OFF, that's 90% downtime.
• Very few electric winches will work fully submersed, and when they do they cause significant damage to the winch over time, most just short out as they get water across their brushes.
• As the load increases, the line in speed decreases, eventually coming up to a stall (maximum capacity of the winch), the larger the load, the quicker the motor heats up.
• Specific to our trucks, every electric winch will decrease our approach angle other than the MileMarker SE12000C, which uses the Hydraulic MM winch plate, and retains your factory (no winch) angle.

Basic Advantages

• Very portable, and easily movable between vehicles
• Will operate on remaining battery power, even when engine is off
• Easy to operate and install
• Inexpensive to implement

Basic Advantages of a Hydraulic winch

• Factory (no winch) mounting location, does not affect approach angle.
• Speed is not affected by load, it will retain its constant speed regardless of what load is on the winch up to it's maximum capacity (either 10,500 or 12,000)
• Winch is constant duty. You can run this 24hrs a day or until you run out of diesel and it will not heat up, it will not deteriorate in any way.
• Can run under water, fully submerged for as long as you need it or want it.
• Very reliable, very limited maintenance required
• Current military winch contract

Basic Disadvantage of a hydraulic winch

• Will not run with your engine off
• It gives priority to your brakes and steering, meaning that this now becomes a "self recovery winch" because it will not run if you are sitting in your cab, brakes applied recovering someone else. Either a line lock, strapping to another object or applying parking brakes is necessary.
• Fairly complex to install/integrate
• Costs similar to that of a quality electric winch

So in the end, the advantages of the hydraulic MileMarker are huge, especially if you use your winch frequently. However, it really does depend on that. You really need to look at how often you will use it, how often you rely on it just in case, whether the approach angle matters to you, and when and with who you do your offroading.



IF:



-You always offroad in groups, you rarely have seen a need for a winch, and you don't care about approach angle => Keep your stock Warn, otherwise don't waste the money



-You offroad alone or are usually trail leader, and you do not care about approach angle =>Keep your Warn, but make sure it's in good working order (10 years or older, do a complete overhaul)



-You offroad alone, find yourself pulling trucks out all the time when you do offroad with others, and generally use your winch a lot =>MileMarker Hydraulic all the way..





Notice how the MileMarker Electric (SE12000C) I didn't recommend anywhere even though it gives you a better approach angle? That is simple because I think it's a crap winch, I have seen nothing but poor reviews, and complaints in northern environments where the winches are exposed to a lot of salt.





That was almost an essay, hope it answers more questions than presents new ones!

In terms of rebuilding a Industrial Warn, it really depends on how significant the rebuild is.

• Rebuild all seals, pack with grease ~$100 depending where you source parts (Do not go through AMG, you will pay 2x to 3x for some parts)
• + New Motor or local rebuild ~$100-$300 (New Chinese motors are $65 on ebay, $100 shipped, while rebuilding your existing one should cost you about $200 locally at a starter/alternator place)
• + New Solenoid pack ~$50-$250 (depending if you rebuild it, or get a new one.. and where you source it)

If you pull it apart, and you find corroded gears, cracked or bent pieces.. it quickly gets to a point where it is not worth rebuilding.



So worst case scenario.. $650 for a complete overhaul, not including sand blasting or sanding, painting and general cleaning.





I think I can safely say I can do a complete overhaul on most Warns for about $500 including labor, but I am not 100% on that. (I am only on my third one, all three belong to me)

they sure did look almost brand new!

Hey guys,



Not to take away from this topic, but has anyone ever had any experience with this winch in hands on applications: http://truckandwinch.com/recon-17500-lb-winch.html



Thanks,

You really get what you pay for. The recon's are on the same level as the Champion Winches. I do not have any hands on time with Recon's but I have heard some Jeep guys use them who complained about how cheap the solenoid box was built, and that the winch is not waterproof in any way.

[quote name='lisazhang' timestamp='1305349681' post='27678']

yes,,by extreme useing,all winches will be some fails,,if the user like fast speed,,asking a bigger motor,such as twin motor xdyna winch

[/quote]



Where are we supposed to fit this winch?